Ultimate Amiga
Network Boards => AMOS Language Discussion => AMOS Factory => AMOS Professional Forum => Topic started by: rednova on December 15, 2016, 01:43:18 AM
-
Dear Friends:
A long time ago I was told here that is possible to make a game like last ninja (c64)
in amospro. Is it possible to make a game like pc diablo from blizzard ?
in amospro ?
Please help me !!!
-
Even if coding in asm on A1200 with fast ram it would be very hard, so in Amos there is no chance to wrote things like diablo. :'(
You can try isometric turn-based rpg, but it will be slowish as hell... ???
-
Adding to what Selur said, the original Diablo required a graphics card capable of 16-bit color at a minimum resolution of 800x600, a SoundBlaster compatible sound card, 16 Megs of RAM, and a Pentium CPU. The original was probably written in Visual C++ using DirectX for graphics acceleration. Blizzard was famous for making things system-friendly using DirectX. I've even been able to run Diablo on a modern system and it still works mostly!
Considering that Amos would require an extension for graphics card support and a better compiler for execution speed, this puts Diablo firmly in 68060 territory at worst and Vampire 68080 territory as more ideal. The killer is the real-time lighting effects that require all the tiles to be redrawn on each frame. Even without that, the color depth of ECS chipset graphics is a 5 or 6 bit color depth so it won't ever look as good without a graphics card, even if you modeled all the tiles in Lightwave (which you'd have to do to get the full light shading effects).
An example of an Amiga game with light-sourcing but overhead instead of isometric is BOH. BOH requires a PowerPC accelerator to run at full-speed and is written in C using SDL as its graphics support.
-
i'm sure you could go without all those PC style specs and do something similar but with 'standard' isometric.
I dont see why it needs to be turn-based, but I know Selur always doubts that you can do anything decent on AMOS for speed anyway ;)
-
True, but if you look in the first post, he wants Diablo style, not Last Ninja.
-
True, but if you look in the first post, he wants Diablo style, not Last Ninja.
last ninja is screen-swapping is it not?
I was thinking scrolling isometric .... more like Desert Strike
There used to be a video on YouTube showing this done really nicely with TOME, but sadly it seems to have been deleted. I think it also demo'ed an number of other TOME based games.
-
Last Ninja is a scrolling isometric.
-
Last Ninja is a scrolling isometric.
When?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=osy-YCyId2M?t=7 - screen swap (Last Ninja Remix)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gws9eNrxcyU?t=4:30 - screen swap (Last Ninja 2)
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=cRLY5RE1rsc - screen swap (Last Ninja 3)
List of scrolling type games (category includes Desert Strike) , and Angled beginning with L:
http://hol.abime.net/hol_search.php?&N_ref_genre_scrolltype=8&af=L&N_ref_genre_viewpoint=1
all games:
http://hol.abime.net/hol_search.php?&N_ref_genre_scrolltype=8&N_ref_genre_viewpoint=1
-
Perhaps Rednova would care to comment on whether he means light sourced or just scrolling.
-
yeap I always say that Amos is really slow and it is. :D
Look this game how slow is isometric rpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE5ZD6a31-k
in Amos it will be slower. :-\
-
yeap I always say that Amos is really slow and it is. :D
Look this game how slow is isometric rpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE5ZD6a31-k
in Amos it will be slower. :-\
One example doesn't make it slow.
It depends on how it is coded. The example is also meaningless if it's not an amos game.
Slap a load of in line Asm in there and why would it be any slower?
The TOME demo shows that isometric can be done on amos with good speed.
-
yeap I always say that Amos is really slow and it is. :D
Look this game how slow is isometric rpg https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TE5ZD6a31-k
in Amos it will be slower. :-\
This game is obviously blitter scrolling tile by tile drawing transparent blits. If hardware scrolling were used, only the edges would need redrawing and it would be faster.
UGH! There are so many things I'd like to code and seldom have time to do it all. I now know how Scrolling Trick works on Aminet but don't have time to tranlate the C and Assembly code into an extension.
-
https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=Os0lKwL6J0A
-
@BooBoo
That's not like either the Last Ninja or Diablo. It's not even isometric. I like it and it looks interesting but it isn't like Diablo.
-
If you can convert something like this to 32 colour http://www.diablowiki.net/Lut_Gholein_map its not going to be that hard - isometric means nothing its just the same as displaying any other map but the collision would be a bit tricky. I dont have the time convert diablo graphics to 32 colour iff for test and scroll but whats the point its obvious it would work.
-
Diablo looks like [youtube]aspBNLex3w4[/youtube] https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aspBNLex3w4 and when you get to the dungeon it has real-time light-sourcing if you watch the video at about the halfway mark.
-
Your have to ask the original poster but I think its a given to do such light effects on Amiga would be very time consuming but a isometric game is no problem.
-
Dear Friends:
A long time ago I was told here that is possible to make a game like last ninja (c64)
in amospro. Is it possible to make a game like pc diablo from blizzard ?
in amospro ?
Please help me !!!
There you go. Your answer is: At low resolution and without light sourcing.
-
Thank you all for replying to my question.
I see now my question was ambiguous and not concise.
The light source and the resolution does not matter to me.
What I really would like to get like diablo is the scrolling screen,
and the sprite animation.
Thank you all !!!
-
You're welcome, Rednova. Do you need any further assistance?
-
#BooBoo
"isometric means nothing its just the same as displaying any other map"
Absolutely not. There is huge difference between flat 2d and isometric display. Isometric consume much more memory and time to display.
As i said isometric in Amos will be slow as hell..fire even in 32 colors :P
For example "Genesia" is isometric turn based game written in Amos/asm in only 16 color and it is very slow on stock A500.
Ofcourse if u will use MC 68030 and much Ram then u can try do isometric game surely, but i guess we talking about something like stock A1200.
-
A isometric tile would take no more time to display than a non isometric tile why would it the Amiga can't tell the difference.
-
Overdraw makes the difference. Each row needs to preserve the mask plane because it is another layer that can't be opaque blitted.
-
Do I really have to do it? Load in Robot monsters map or a like it will just be normal 16*16 tiles.
-
@BooBoo
I would think they would be BOBs extending above the diamond-shaped bases with a hot spot in the middle of the diamond. I's say that a 32x64 tile with the even tiles up 8 and to the left 16 of the odd row tiles.
-
For example in "Utopia" u need to overlay half tile of next each other.
(https://www.spriters-resource.com/resources/sheets/56/58926.png)
however I would gladly see isometric game in Amos because I wonder how fast it could be.
-
For a 320x160 screen we'd need 105 BOBs to fill the screen and 4 times that to make it scroll efficiently without any Copper tricks. Fortunately, most of the BOBs will be stationary objects and will not need to be redrawn unless a character walks behind it. The default limit for number of BOBs is only 63 but the manual says this can be increased.
-
The default limit for number of BOBs is only 63 but the manual says this can be increased.
It can, up to a maximum of either 128 or 256 (or possibly more).
I'm no bob expert, but the more bobs you have onscreen the slower the update is. I have found this with my Eternal T3 game and I only have a maximum of 16 bobs in use (they are quite large though: 60x60 pixels in 32 colours). I update them manually, but haven't found a way to update a single bob - AMOS seems to update all active bobs at the same time :(
-
Dang! I will have to rewrite AmosPro before too long! Graphics.library used Layers.library to avoid updates of BOBs.
-
It can, up to a maximum of either 128 or 256 (or possibly more).
Just to confirm it, I checked just now. To change the number of maximum bobs that you can use:
- AMOS Pro > Config (drop-down menu) > Set Interpreter
- Click "Load Default Configuration" (or load in another one you have set up)
- Click "Set System Configuration, page 2"
- Bobs is top option (set at 68 on my current setup, min: 8 , max: 255)
-
Does it matter though?
Surely this method if written right would just use paste bob for the "floor"/background as an alternative to using paste icon (which iirc lacks transparency)
You would optimise to only use a real bob where you need to go behind an object, thus reducing the overall bob number considerably
-
The floor sections are diamond shaped and interlocking so that they always overlap.
-
Then get smart with graphic design and draw tiles that are the overlaps required ;)
Something like Cannon Fodder which is faux-isometric
-
I'd sooner narrow the visible screen by putting status bars on the left and right border using sprites as if they were screens.